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(Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
[版面:葵花宝典][首篇作者:guvest] , 2020年05月21日23:09:03 ,547次阅读,22次回复
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guvest
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发信人: guvest (我爱你老婆Anna), 信区: Programming
标  题: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Thu May 21 23:09:03 2020, 美东)

[i really do not think those type of scores matters if you are not concerned
with the job market, though the trends is very interesting. ]

Today, in the IEEE Spectrum's sixth annual ranking, Python's 100 is a long
way ahead of runner-up Java's 96.3 score, while C is in third place with 94.
4. C   has slipped to fourth with 87.5, while in fifth is specialist
statistical computing language R with a score of 81.5.

The magazine for engineering members of IEEE, the world's biggest
engineering and applied-science organization, attributes Python's popularity
to the vast number of specialized libraries it has, especially for
developers building artificial-intelligence applications.

—-ZDnet, sep 20, 2019
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tfusion
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发信人: tfusion (雷熔), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Thu May 21 23:46:59 2020, 美东)

前两名难道不是Javascript和PHP么?
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guvest
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发信人: guvest (我爱你老婆Anna), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 00:09:46 2020, 美东)

I did not purchase IEEE anymore and did not read the original article. There
could be some analysis.

本版多数是web这波的。mobile贴都极少。其他方面的軟件工程更加少。


【 在 tfusion(雷熔) 的大作中提到: 】
<br>: 前两名难道不是Javascript和PHP么?
<br>
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netghost
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发信人: netghost (Up to Isomorphism), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 00:37:23 2020, 美东)

For system programming, my experience is that python development is actually
slower than C if you consider deployment and scalability into account. In
order to use these "nice" features from python, you need to sacrifice the
architecture so much that in case any future performance improvement is
required you basically need to rewrite the whole program.


【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: [i really do not think those type of scores matters if you are not
concerned
:  with the job market, though the trends is very interesting. ]
: Today, in the IEEE Spectrum's sixth annual ranking, Python's 100 is a long
: way ahead of runner-up Java's 96.3 score, while C is in third place with
94.
: 4. C   has slipped to fourth with 87.5, while in fifth is specialist
: statistical computing language R with a score of 81.5.
: The magazine for engineering members of IEEE, the world's biggest
: engineering and applied-science organization, attributes Python's
popularity
:  to the vast number of specialized libraries it has, especially for
: developers building artificial-intelligence applications.
: ...................


--

※ 修改:·netghost 于 May 22 00:39:14 2020 修改本文·[FROM: 71.]
※ 来源:·BBS 未名空间站 网址:mitbbs.com 移动:在应用商店搜索未名空间·[FROM: 71.]

 
tfusion
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发信人: tfusion (雷熔), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 00:57:43 2020, 美东)

我大学写汇编,Fortran,研究生写C,C++,工作之后用Java,现在只写php和
Javascript

【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: I did not purchase IEEE anymore and did not read the original article.
There
:  could be some analysis.
: 本版多数是web这波的。mobile贴都极少。其他方面的軟件工程更加少。
: <br>: 前两名难道不是Javascript和PHP么?
: <br>



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guvest
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发信人: guvest (我爱你老婆Anna), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 01:01:49 2020, 美东)

Python is the leading tool in the AI/ML, cyber security, numerical
computation, ... areas. However,in many cases, python is used together with
c/cpp.

【 在 netghost (Up to Isomorphism) 的大作中提到: 】
: For system programming, my experience is that python development is
actually
:  slower than C if you consider deployment and scalability into account. In
: order to use these "nice" features from python, you need to sacrifice the
: architecture so much that in case any future performance improvement is
: required you basically need to rewrite the whole program.
: concerned
: 94.
: popularity




--
※ 修改:·guvest 於 May 22 01:12:14 2020 修改本文·[FROM: 76.]
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netghost
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发信人: netghost (Up to Isomorphism), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 01:07:08 2020, 美东)

Because all these are CPU bounded tasks(except cyber security), you do not
need to sacrifice too much architecture-wise in order to get the "nice"
features, the hotspot can be replaced with more efficient language
implementations, basically python is a more sophiscated shell.

Also the result from these programs are usually more valuable than the
program itself, so deployment is less of an issue.
【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: Python is the leading tool in the AI/ML, cyber security, numerical
: computation, ... areas. In many cases, python is used together with c/cpp.
: actually



--

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guvest
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发信人: guvest (我爱你老婆Anna), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 01:10:59 2020, 美东)

我本科毕业设计,是把一本数学物理算法书从Fortran翻译成C。
人肉trancompiler。LOL
【 在 tfusion (雷熔) 的大作中提到: 】
: 我大学写汇编,Fortran,研究生写C,C++,工作之后用Java,现在只写php和
: Javascript
: There





--
※ 修改:·guvest 於 May 22 01:11:36 2020 修改本文·[FROM: 76.]
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xiaoju
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发信人: xiaoju (可爱的龙猫), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 07:46:46 2020, 美东)

python和C什么时候能放在一起比了。。。

【 在 netghost (Up to Isomorphism) 的大作中提到: 】
: For system programming, my experience is that python development is
actually
:  slower than C if you consider deployment and scalability into account. In
: order to use these "nice" features from python, you need to sacrifice the
: architecture so much that in case any future performance improvement is
: required you basically need to rewrite the whole program.
: concerned
: 94.
: popularity



--
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xiaoju
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发信人: xiaoju (可爱的龙猫), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 07:53:01 2020, 美东)

不懂不要胡扯

python在ml流行是因为numpy免费且用法类似matlab,在dl流行是因为其动态类型系统
便于构造计算图和transpile到GPU等多种架构

【 在 netghost (Up to Isomorphism) 的大作中提到: 】
: Because all these are CPU bounded tasks(except cyber security), you do not
: need to sacrifice too much architecture-wise in order to get the "nice"
: features, the hotspot can be replaced with more efficient language
: implementations, basically python is a more sophiscated shell.
: Also the result from these programs are usually more valuable than the
: program itself, so deployment is less of an issue.



--
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xiaoju
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发信人: xiaoju (可爱的龙猫), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 07:59:54 2020, 美东)

一般来说python并不是和C++一起用的

大部分python代码是纯python,C++仅被用来优化计算任务或者作为OS接口的胶水。由
于python的流行性,自己有机会写新轮子的可能几乎不存在。

【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: Python is the leading tool in the AI/ML, cyber security, numerical
: computation, ... areas. However,in many cases, python is used together
with
: c/cpp.
: actually



--
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ananpig
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发信人: ananpig (别瞅 变态辣椒 漫画的●○安安猪), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 17:10:25 2020, 美东)

过了一年可能,变成编程语言都有新变化了





【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: [i really do not think those type of scores matters if you are not
concerned
:  with the job market, though the trends is very interesting. ]
: Today, in the IEEE Spectrum's sixth annual ranking, Python's 100 is a long
: way ahead of runner-up Java's 96.3 score, while C is in third place with
94.
: 4. C   has slipped to fourth with 87.5, while in fifth is specialist
: statistical computing language R with a score of 81.5.
: The magazine for engineering members of IEEE, the world's biggest
: engineering and applied-science organization, attributes Python's
popularity
:  to the vast number of specialized libraries it has, especially for
: developers building artificial-intelligence applications.
: ...................


--

※ 来源:·BBS 未名空间站 网址:mitbbs.com 移动:在应用商店搜索未名空间·[FROM: 24.]

 
ananpig
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发信人: ananpig (别瞅 变态辣椒 漫画的●○安安猪), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 17:12:01 2020, 美东)

正想又玩一玩 lua 呢,都不上榜了啊





【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: [i really do not think those type of scores matters if you are not
concerned
:  with the job market, though the trends is very interesting. ]
: Today, in the IEEE Spectrum's sixth annual ranking, Python's 100 is a long
: way ahead of runner-up Java's 96.3 score, while C is in third place with
94.
: 4. C   has slipped to fourth with 87.5, while in fifth is specialist
: statistical computing language R with a score of 81.5.
: The magazine for engineering members of IEEE, the world's biggest
: engineering and applied-science organization, attributes Python's
popularity
:  to the vast number of specialized libraries it has, especially for
: developers building artificial-intelligence applications.
: ...................


--

※ 来源:·BBS 未名空间站 网址:mitbbs.com 移动:在应用商店搜索未名空间·[FROM: 24.]

 
guvest
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发信人: guvest (我爱你老婆Anna), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 17:59:20 2020, 美东)

我之前想用lua,后来看到这个社区明显走下坡路。就没考虑了。
【 在 ananpig (别瞅 变态辣椒 漫画的●○安安猪) 的大作中提到: 】
: 正想又玩一玩 lua 呢,都不上榜了啊
: https://i.imgur.com/6h5CG0r.jpg
: concerned
: 94.
: popularity



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xiaoju
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发信人: xiaoju (可爱的龙猫), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 22:14:07 2020, 美东)

当年alphago的torch用了lua,是这个语言最风光的时候

可惜alphago被谷歌收购后转为tensorflow,而torch又删号重练变成了pytorch

【 在 ananpig (别瞅 变态辣椒 漫画的●○安安猪) 的大作中提到: 】
: 正想又玩一玩 lua 呢,都不上榜了啊
: https://i.imgur.com/6h5CG0r.jpg
: concerned
: 94.
: popularity



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oOOo
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发信人: oOOo (\_/o!o\_/), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 22:59:14 2020, 美东)

不是开玩笑吧。有现成的工具翻译fortran到C。干嘛重造轮子?

【 在 guvest (我爱你老婆Anna) 的大作中提到: 】
: 我本科毕业设计,是把一本数学物理算法书从Fortran翻译成C。
: 人肉trancompiler。LOL




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xiaoju
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发信人: xiaoju (可爱的龙猫), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 23:03:52 2020, 美东)

他概念不太清楚,人肉翻译和机器transpile从过程和算法上都不一样

人肉翻译类似深度学习的attention算法,是个概率模型只能保证大致准确,所以需要
仔细测试,但计算复杂度低

PLT的transpile是图灵语言的等价转换,但需要构建语法树,人脑是完成不了的。

【 在 oOOo (_/o!o_/) 的大作中提到: 】
: 不是开玩笑吧。有现成的工具翻译fortran到C。干嘛重造轮子?



--
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oOOo
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发信人: oOOo (\_/o!o\_/), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 23:31:20 2020, 美东)

没那么复杂 f2c是很成熟的工具 而去可读性很好

【 在 xiaoju (可爱的龙猫) 的大作中提到: 】
: 他概念不太清楚,人肉翻译和机器transpile从过程和算法上都不一样
: 人肉翻译类似深度学习的attention算法,是个概率模型只能保证大致准确,所以需要
: 仔细测试,但计算复杂度低
: PLT的transpile是图灵语言的等价转换,但需要构建语法树,人脑是完成不了的。




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xiaoju
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发信人: xiaoju (可爱的龙猫), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 23:35:06 2020, 美东)

当年没有互联网和英文书的时代,很多人不知道。。。

国内90年代的时候,不少老师布置翻译程序当学生论文的

【 在 oOOo (_/o!o_/) 的大作中提到: 】
: 没那么复杂 f2c是很成熟的工具 而去可读性很好



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guvest
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发信人: guvest (我爱你老婆Anna), 信区: Programming
标  题: Re: (Ieee spectrum) Language popularity
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Fri May 22 23:57:42 2020, 美东)

你哪一年第一次看到这种现成的工具的。Dos有吗?
另外我讲的很清楚了。我是从书上翻译的。一
般书上只给你关键部分的代码片段。不是完整的程序。你要敲进去,弄完头尾,要几个
月。
不管你用什么语言。更重要的是,学校不是做产品。我的导师姓周,乃是80,90年代就
曾经在最
好的ieee杂志发文章的人。他30岁左右从美国回国,分了大房子,娶了老婆。等于就退
休了,后来专心混日子。再没发过文章。我怀
疑他的意思就是叫我不要胡思乱想。刷题。

另外我不同意所谓的“重造轮子”这种说法。这个说法导致的行为很多时候
是对的,就是多用可靠的库。但是原因是错误的。

将来你就懂了。在车上的轮子,和不在车上的轮子。它不是一个轮子。就好像你的手,
在身上和不在身上能一回事吗?
【 在 oOOo(\_/o!o\_/) 的大作中提到: 】
<br>: 不是开玩笑吧。有现成的工具翻译fortran到C。干嘛重造轮子?
<br>








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※ 修改:·guvest 於 May 23 00:14:03 2020 修改本文·[FROM: 76.]
※ 来源:· 未名空间站 网址:mitbbs.com 移动:在应用商店搜索未名空间·[FROM: 76.]

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